I figured out the 4gb scam!

[daveislander]

Errr,, sorry to be negative here,, but I am still seeing a photo of the 4gig(1Gig) player I bought.. Its still showing on the main page.. Perhaps a bit more filtering is required?

[michiganjfrog]

[quote="daveislander";p="15350"]


*The standard EBay reply is used every time,, namely, THEY are not responcible for all the items posted on the site,, they rely upon the sellers honesty and do not have the resources to check the veracity of any claims made.. *

Blameshifting BS, of course. When there isn't a true 4GB Nano clone on the ENTIRE SITE, because ***4GB NANO CLONES FROM CHINA DO NOT EXIST****, then there is no question about "relying upon the seller's honesty". The seller's are fraudulent, plain and simple. They may have had an excuse in the past about not knowing the boards on the Nano clones are currently not capable of accepting a 4GB configuration. They have no excuse now, because it's an established FACT. Established by investigations done on this site and other sources.

Furthermore, their sister co. Paypal, asks for 3rd party verification when such a claim of fraud is made. If one person does that, then eBay doesn't need "the resources to check the claim". In a case like this, where there ARE NO KNOWN TRUE 4GB CLONES, it'd have to be up to the seller to prove their item is not fraudulent in order to go on selling the devices, in light of all the evidence that 4GB clones dont exist! And not simply make restitution to the buyers before their 90 days are up.


*They DO investigate claims of fraud, but as long as the seller is making 'reasonable' attempts to rectify the problem, they can not intervene.. *

Hence the reason the sellers ask for the players back...

*It is apparently not fair to expect sellers to pay the costs involved with sending back items that may simply be not what the customer thought it was (honestly!).*

Except this isn't simply a case of where the buyer has buyer's remorse. This is a case where the SELLER is fraudulently advertising false claims. In that case, as it has been pointed out here by one burned buyer, it IS the seller's responsibility to assume all costs involved in rectifying the situation. And the seller is at risk of criminal charges, if he continues to sell and advertise the same fraudulent merchandise, after a complaint has been made.

It's obvious that complaints need to be made to government agencies that govern the practices of eBay, if eBay won't respond within their organization to protect the eBay community of buyers, by recognizing the FACT that there ARE NO KNOWN 4GB NANO CLONES ANYWHERE.

*Ebay have no knowledge or expertese with technology and are not in a position to say that a 4gig MP3/MP4 product is genuine or not... *

They don't have to be. They simply have to acceptable reasonable 3rd party evidence of such a fact. If they do not wish to accept reasonable 3rd party evidence verifying these facts, they are party to fraud themselves.

*There are certainly 4gig MP3 players available and they wouldn't be willing to place a warning on all MP3 players just because some have 'problems'*

Once again, NO ONE IS ASKING THEM TO!! We are talking about NANO CLONES, not "All MP3 players!". In fact, these are popularly known as "MP4 players" not "MP3 players". No warning is necessary for Apple iPods and I'm not sure, but there may be some non-apple chinese non-brand name MP4 players (which are NOT Nano clones) that have more than 2gb of flash.

*Ebay might consider a warning in the forums, they claim that there are already warnings out there,, but they could not condone a company being accused of fraud unless this was proven in a court of Law.*

ALL THAT HAS TO BE PROVEN is that there are NO known chinese noname Nano knockoffs (MP4 players which look like the Nano) that have 4GB memory. So its ridiculous to litigate every eBay seller to prove it in a court of law when its a known fact that there are NO eBay sellers that have been proven to be selling true 4GB chinese Nano clones.

*There are less complaints about MP3 players than many other products and this is probably because the companies involved take extraordinary steps to rectify problems as they base their business on good feeback and couldn't continue to trade if they were 'inundated with complaints' as my comments (to them on the telephone) would imply.*

BS. If you look at the feedback records of most hong kong 4GB MP4 Nano knockoff sellers on eBay, you find their feedback records are piss poor. It's AVERAGE to see several DOZEN negative feedbacks in the last month from these sellers! (They don't just sell fraudulent mp4 players....). They use multiple accounts, so they can simply hide their feedback by opening a new account, when it gets too bad. FEEDBACK SYSTEM DOESN"T DO SH*T TO PROTECT EBAY CUSTOMERS when eBay sellers have the opportunity to change their accounts or use multiple ones. So in short, yes they can continue to trade no matter how many people they rip off, no problem sir. And what's more, the extra profits they make from selling 1GB players at 4GB prices, makes up for reduced sales if their negs get too high.

*There are other things said, but the truth as far as I am concerned is that Ebay dont want to know.. they make a HUGE profit from the chinese companies and its a huge market that they are just beginning to get access to. *

Absofreakinlutely. I have no problem seeing that. That's why I say those burned have to take the fight against eBay to trade commissions that regulate eBay's practices, and to 3rd party web press. The US gov needs to be aware that eBay is protecting fraudulent merchandisers, and so does the public at large. This hasn't bitten eBay CEO's in the ass yet, because it isn't that well known. How many people need to be burned with these 4GB players until it is?

[daveislander]

Obviously I agree with you 100%.. I have spent hours and hours in contact with these folk.. I have contacted the Chinese Embassy, the Hong Kong Traders.. Ebay, Paypal and trading standards here in the UK.. It has become something of a mission for me, and at every turn there are excuses, explanations and 'reasons', but no action! As an ex freelance journalist even I am having problems getting enough genuine information to fight these folk!
What WE must remember is that even 100 complaints against a product are split between 20, 30, 40 or 50 countries.. I can contact Ebay.co.uk but they will only discuss .co.uk issues.. trying to get them to collate the total complaints is hard and obviously they have no interest in doing so.
I have no doubt that eventually someone here (maybe even me) will find a chink (pardon pun) in their armour.. but there must be no doubts that Ebay & Paypal will need a bloody big fright to get them to remove such a good money spinner.

[admin]

michiganjfrog,

I would have thought, if eBay gets enough complaints about one particluar eBay seller, they would do something about it?


princessanne1026,

Good find. Hopefully people can write more on it and more importantly customers actually search and read it before buying.


daveislander,

I'll try to redefine the search exclusion again. Try for multiple keyword exclusions as well as account name exclusion.

[michiganjfrog]

Originally Posted by admin";p=&quot

michiganjfrog,

I would have thought, if eBay gets enough complaints about one particluar eBay seller, they would do something about it?

Well I have yet to hear of a single hacked MP4 case where they did. I only hear people complaining eBay is leaving them out to dry, taking the seller's side. The popular notion is, they're making too much money to be motivated to close sellers accounts. I am convinced by all I've seen that eBay is well aware of the rampant problem of hacked 4GB players. However, they are falling all over themselves to pass the buck and avoid looking at it as a worlwide eBay SCANDAL.

That's my beef with eBay. They're pretending it isn't a big deal to avoid those hong kong dollars. But who here knows of a 4GB Nano lookalike chinese clone that is actually 4GB? (And there are many non-Nano's that are also fake GB's) If there are NONE, then all of those sellers on all eBay sites are selling fraudulent merchandise. With all the reports people have had who purchased 4GB players, that should be enough evidence for eBay to put a stop to it, since no Nano clone seller can prove the units they're shipping contain 4GigaBYTES of flash, and its been proven the chips being used can't be used in a 4GB configuration. After all, epay had no problem changing the rules for how you could sell Playstation 3's (making sellers show photos of cash register receipts etc etc).

[daveislander]

On the very rare occasions that Ebay have been forced into action (TV exposure or bad Press), they have indeed shut down a supplier... who promptly re-register with the same details but different name and carry on regardless.. A recent TV exposure about forged goods resulted in three UK suppliers being targetted,, but the original sellers were ignored and allowed to carry on advertising their goods.. In other words.. whoever makes Ebay the least amount of money is targetted whilst the really big earners are ignored.. This is a global scam, and needs global action to stop it.

[etailer]

UGoole / e-britain is a crook. I sell Chinese players on Ebay and was wondering how this guy could sell a 4 GB player for the price I would have to sell a 2GB player to turn a profit. It really hurts the honest Ebay sellers. Who would by my 2 GB player when they can get a 4GB player for the same price?

Just thought I would give some perspective from an American Seller.

Chris

[dacathey]

Wish that I found this forum earlier. I have a 4GB and can copy 2GB before all of the files start becoming corrupt. My question is since it looks like I get no help from Ebay how can I fix the firmware so that I have a fully functional 2GB player.

[Que]

Originally Posted by etailer";p=&quot

UGoole / e-britain is a crook. I sell Chinese players on Ebay and was wondering how this guy could sell a 4 GB player for the price I would have to sell a 2GB player to turn a profit.
Chris

He can't, he is selling 4Gb players (gigabit) at most, if people are lucky it turns out 1 gigabyte. There are no 4 gigabyte (GB) chipods for sale. The chipsets used only support 2 gigabyte maximum sofar. You could put a disclaimer in your ads warning people for the GB versus Gb thing, the maximum of 2 GB supported by the chipset, and the memory you have -2048 mb- in your players. Someday the masses will wise up.

[Que]

Originally Posted by dacathey";p=&quot

Wish that I found this forum earlier. I have a 4GB and can copy 2GB before all of the files start becoming corrupt. My question is since it looks like I get no help from Ebay how can I fix the firmware so that I have a fully functional 2GB player.

You don't have to fix the firmware, use the method described here to get the real data size:
how to remove the memoty hack